NYCkayaker Anyone doing this Sunday's Governors Island Swim support?

[Lee S. Goldsmith]

What we are doing is a rather piece meal discussion of a very important
activity.  Everyone is adding an item or two to the list of kayak duties
rather than forming a comprehensive list.  
	1. Safety:
		a. Includes being available if the swimmer has a
problem.
		b. Being aware of flotsam that may cause the swimmer
harm.
		c, Acting as barrier to potential harm, e.g. power boats

	2. Acting to transmit messages to and from the escort.
	3. Acting to transmit food to the swimmer from the escort. 
	4. Acting as the eyes to the swimmer so that they know whether
or not they are on course.  
	5. Following instructions from the swimmer and escort as it
relates to the swimmer, the course or whatever else is necessary to do,
inlcuding yelling encouragement.  
	6. You do not draft for the swimmer, you do not allow the
swimmer to hold on but hand the food over and retrieve the empties. 
	
	Remember each of the boats has a race monitor and if you are
doing something improper they should be aware.  

	If you meet with the swimmer before hand you have an opportunity
to go over the course, get guidance from the swimmer and their team and
at the same time impart your own knowledge to the swimmer and crew that
has been gained by doing this marathon multiple times.  I personally do
not see anything improper in that.  

	Though I don't play golf I think that it is somewhat similar to
the pro golfer selecting his/her caddy.  I have never heard of the
golfer selecting a caddy who did not know the course and could not help
out with information.  I do believe that the better golfers get the
better caddies.  

	Lee Goldsmith 

-----Original Message-----
From: nyckayaker-bounces at rockandwater.net
[mailto:nyckayaker-bounces at rockandwater.net] On Behalf Of David Gottlieb
Sent: Monday, June 30, 2008 1:06 PM
To: mike; 'Richard Clifford'; nyckayaker at rockandwater.net
Subject: Re: NYCkayaker Anyone doing this Sunday's Governors Island Swim
support?


I said I wasn't going to comment on this again but on some of the
escorts I have done for open-water swims where I have been assigned to
one individual swimmer, I have been told the following.

That each kayaker is the eyes of the swimmer, particularly in rougher
water because swimmer navigation is difficult due to wave and current
action.

That's it. That's what I was told. Besides the safety and communication
duties I also had.

That's it.... 

David

On 6/30/08 12:56 PM, "mike" <mpidel at optonline.net> wrote:

> Richard I never saw or had a kayak escort at any of the open water 
> swims I did, they were all triathlons and Greenwich 1-mile open water
swim.
> Open water swim navigation was a skill that was taught and practiced.
> I am surprised they let a swimmer use a kayaker as their guidance.
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: nyckayaker-bounces at rockandwater.net [mailto:nyckayaker- 
>>> bounces at rockandwater.net] On Behalf Of Richard Clifford
>>> Sent: Monday, June 30, 2008 10:36 AM
>>> To: nyckayaker at rockandwater.net
>>> Subject: NYCkayaker Anyone doing this Sunday's Governors Island Swim

>>> support?
>>> 
>>> NYCKayaker:
>>> 
>>>    The assertion in this post in incorrect. I have participated as a

>>> kayaker escorting swimmers in these events for 15+ years. I have 
>>> done this at the US Nationals Open Water 25K swims in Florida
repeatedly.
>>> And, I have done the escorting for the chair of the Open Water 
>>> Committee of the US Masters swimming. And, the post mixes several
>>> 
>>>    It is not helpful when people jump on the list and make these 
>>> bold, unsupported assertions. Support what you say. Otherwise mark 
>>> what you say as assertion/opinion not fact. - Richard Clifford
>>> 
>>> 
>>> mike wrote:
>>>>  *I am always surprised they allow the guiding by kayak in these
races.
>>> It
>>>> would be a violation in any sanctioned open water-swimming event.* 
>>>> A
>>> huge
>>>> component of the challenge of open water swimming is the ability to
>>> navigate
>>>> and swim in straight line, In a pool it Is quite easy to follow the
>>> lines in
>>>> the open water it is a different stroke technique to navigate.
>>>> *I would think *the kayak escort would have to stay behind the 
>>>> swimmer
>>> for a
>>>> proper race.
>>>> I guess the rules are much different in these swim from the 1-mile 
>>>> open water swim races and triathlons *It sounds like* an unfair 
>>>> advantage if some equally ranked swimmers got
>>> a mix
>>>> of very good and mediocre kayak guidance.
>>>> As far as you people being dissed, you should also request to see 
>>>> the
>>> books
>>>> of the events to make sure that you are being equally treated.
>>>> 
>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>> 
>>>> . The skills of the kayakers to guide their swimmer in
>>>> 
>>>>>> the
>>>>>> water can be key to the swimmers time it takes to get to the 
>>>>>> finish
>>> line.
>>>>>> Plus we have to often communicate with police, race officials and
>>> power
>>>>>> boaters on our GPS. I have found that it is really a team effort
>>> between
>>>>>> the
>>>>>> kayaker and the swimmer. If I make a mistake in a Hudson River
>>> crossing
>>>>>> and
>>>>>> tell my swimmer to move to the left instead of the right I could 
>>>>>> cause
>>> him
>>>>>> to lose time.
>>> 
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