NYCkayaker PFD's

Tue May 20 08:28:29 EDT 2008

Hi everybody,

West Marine sent a card with a Memorial day sale with the PFD's like we use in Croton.

Called  ''Runabout Vests'' medium blue with yellow straps  at $ 11.49 with the card I received in the mail.

My advisor here (Mary)  says they are more comfortable to row with than the Sterns vest with the neck chafe edging now in the VCBH.  

I will see how many I can order here, hopefully enough to cover Warren Rowing and Travelers needs.

So Eric, thankyou for your efforts but it looks like West Marine should come through for us

Don Betts
----------------------------------------
> From: nyckayaker-request at rockandwater.net
> Subject: NYCKayaker Digest, Vol 33, Issue 18
> To: nyckayaker at rockandwater.net
> Date: Mon, 19 May 2008 17:59:41 -0400
> 
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> Today's Topics:
> 
>    1. Re:  Captain and Paddlers Day at Pier 66 (Lyn Goldsmith)
>    2. Re:  Captain and Paddlers Day at Pier 66 (bob1may at optonline.net)
>    3. Re:  Captain and Paddlers Day at Pier 66 (Kam Truhn)
>    4. Re:  Captain and Paddlers Day at Pier 66 (Chalu Kim)
>    5.  use of strobes (was captain and paddlers' day) (Nancy Brous)
>    6. Re:  use of strobes (was captain and paddlers' day)
>       (john mcgarvey)
>    7. Re:  Captain and Paddlers Day at Pier 66 (Gordon, Peter)
>    8. Re:  Captain and Paddlers Day at Pier 66 (Lyn Goldsmith)
> 
> 
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> Message: 1
> Date: Mon, 19 May 2008 16:08:32 -0400
> From: "Lyn Goldsmith" 
> Subject: Re: NYCkayaker Captain and Paddlers Day at Pier 66
> To: "Steve McAllister" 
> Cc: nyckayaker 
> Message-ID:
> 	
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
> 
> One other thing that came out loud and clear at the meeting.
> 
> All the captains REALLY like it when we have the red and green lights on our
> kayaks.  They say that even though the lights are close together that it
> immediately identifies us as a vessel.
> 
> The  Human Powered Boating Group (was that the name??) was given credit  for
> the work they did showing and publishing this several years ago.
> 
> Lyn
> 
> On Mon, May 19, 2008 at 3:32 PM, Steve McAllister 
> wrote:
> 
>> Hi Warren
>>> What I took away from this was to realize that the strobe debate is
>>> not dead.
>>>
>>
>> I know what you mean. Even the Coast Guard can't agree.
>>
>> I for one am not looking for any more reasons to have the Coast Guard
>> chase me down because somebody on shore thinks I a look like a boat in
>> distress.
>> Adding a strobe would just increase the calls to the coast guard and
>> paddlers already have a bad enough reputation as it is.
>>
>> stevie
>>
>> --
>> Kayaking, as I know it, is a swimming sport, and the kayak a prosthesis to
>> make the swimming faster, safer, warmer, and more capable in difficult
>> conditions. Kayaks and paddles enhance our swimming ability in the same way
>> that skis enhance our running capability on slopes covered with snow. -- Dan
>> Segal
>>
>> **********************************************************************
>> The NYCKayaker mailing list is hosted by www.rockandwater.net, and is a
>> public service offered to the kayaking community by the Hudson River
>> Watertrail Association. Learn more about HRWA at www.hrwa.org
>>
>> To unsubscribe or change delivery options:
>> http://www.rockandwater.net/mailman/listinfo/nyckayaker
>>
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 2
> Date: Mon, 19 May 2008 20:23:44 +0000 (GMT)
> From: bob1may at optonline.net
> Subject: Re: NYCkayaker Captain and Paddlers Day at Pier 66
> To: nyckayaker 
> Message-ID: 
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
> 
> This is just amazing.First, we have a CG representative advising the public to violate the law by displaying a distress signal when no emergency exists.As if that's not bad enough, they then say "we assume that someone displaying a distress signal is not in distress."Bob----- Original Message -----From: Warren Date: Monday, May 19, 2008 2:14 pmSubject: Re: NYCkayaker Captain and Paddlers Day at Pier 66To: bonnie13 at earthlink.netCc: nyckayaker> Even after hearing the USCG folks say it would be the best> thing, I > knew this would not be the end of the matter.>> My interpretation of what they at the event were saying is:>> The number one easiest thing to see on the water, day or night> is a > strobe. The human eye is naturally is attracted to a strobe. If> you > are crossing a ferry terminal singling with a strobe makes it> more > likely that you will be noticed.>> When questioned about the legality of it, they seemed somewhat> caught > off guard. They stated that!
>   they would not see it as a distress > signal, the first thing they would do is look at you through > binoculars and see you are not in distress. They acknowledged> that it > would be used as a signaling method not as a boat light. Of note> in > their presentation was the requirement for paddlers in regards> to > lighting; have an electric torch ready to signal with as needed.>> There is a recording of what was said it, is of course more > authoritative and accurate than what is stated above.>> What I took away from this was to realize that the strobe debate> is > not dead.>> -Warren>> On May 19, 2008, at 1:41 PM, bonnie13 at earthlink.net wrote:>>> I was not sure I wanted to say anything because - well, just> becasue.>>> But I was pretty sure that what Stevie said was right, and I> was >> curious enough to go find the relevant rule on the USCG> Boating >> Safety site, in the visual distress signal section. And this> isn't >> about kayak politics, t!
>  his is just about making sure we know> what >> the actual rules say
> . So here it is, straight cut & paste from> http://uscgboating.org/safety/fedreqs/equ_vds.htm>>  :>>>> Under Inland Navigation Rules, a high intensity white light> flashing >> at regular intervals from 50-70 times per minute is considered> a >> distress signal. Such devices do NOT count toward meeting the> visual >> distress signal requirement, however.>>>> Regulations prohibit display of visual distress signals on the> water >> under any circumstances except when assistance is required to >> prevent immediate or potential danger to persons on board a vessel.>> **********************************************************************> The NYCKayaker mailing list is hosted by www.rockandwater.net,> and is a public service offered to the kayaking community by the> Hudson River Watertrail Association. Learn more about HRWA at> www.hrwa.org> To unsubscribe or change delivery options:> http://www.rockandwater.net/mailman/listinfo/nyckayaker> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 3
> Date: Mon, 19 May 2008 13:37:42 -0700 (PDT)
> From: Kam Truhn 
> Subject: Re: NYCkayaker Captain and Paddlers Day at Pier 66
> To: nyckayaker 
> Message-ID: 
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
> 
> I was?a little uncomfortable with how the coastguard talked about using strobes for general visibility.? The last thing I want is a?motor boat coming to "rescue" me in the dark.? Distress signals should be unambiguous (although, now I'll turn on a strobe if I think there's a possibility of collision).
> ?
> I think the fact that intermittent light is very noticeable?is a great point that they brought up.? I've noticed this when meeting other kayakers on the water at night.? It seems that bright l.e.d.?headlamps work well because you can aim the focused light at a boat coming towards you to try and?grab?their attention.? If you move your head around a little, the light is intermittent but not strobing at a regular interval.
> ???????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????? -Kam
> 
> ----- Original Message ----
> From: Lyn Goldsmith 
> To: Dan Starer 
> Cc: nyckayaker 
> Sent: Monday, May 19, 2008 4:03:11 PM
> Subject: Re: NYCkayaker Captain and Paddlers Day at Pier 66
> 
> Absolutely...the point is to get seen, then turn if off.
> 
> Lyn
> 
> On Mon, May 19, 2008 at 3:55 PM, Dan Starer  wrote:
> 
>> At the event I asked a Coast Guard guy for more clarification on this
>> issue.? He suggested kayakers use a strobe if in imminent danger of
>> collision or some other danger, but then turn it off after the danger has
>> passed.
>>
>> Dan
>>
>>
>> On Mon, May 19, 2008 at 3:32 PM, Steve McAllister <
>> stevie at brooklynkayak.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Hi Warren
>>>> What I took away from this was to realize that the strobe debate is
>>>> not dead.
>>>>
>>>
>>> I know what you mean. Even the Coast Guard can't agree.
>>>
>>> I for one am not looking for any more reasons to have the Coast Guard
>>> chase me down because somebody on shore thinks I a look like a boat in
>>> distress.
>>> Adding a strobe would just increase the calls to the coast guard and
>>> paddlers already have a bad enough reputation as it is.
>>>
>>> stevie
>>>
>>> --
>>> Kayaking, as I know it, is a swimming sport, and the kayak a prosthesis
>> to
>>> make the swimming faster, safer, warmer, and more capable in difficult
>>> conditions. Kayaks and paddles enhance our swimming ability in the same
>> way
>>> that skis enhance our running capability on slopes covered with snow. --
>> Dan
>>> Segal
>>>
>>> **********************************************************************
>>> The NYCKayaker mailing list is hosted by www.rockandwater.net, and is a
>>> public service offered to the kayaking community by the Hudson River
>>> Watertrail Association. Learn more about HRWA at www.hrwa.org
>>>
>>> To unsubscribe or change delivery options:
>>> http://www.rockandwater.net/mailman/listinfo/nyckayaker
>>>
>> **********************************************************************
>> The NYCKayaker mailing list is hosted by www.rockandwater.net, and is a
>> public service offered to the kayaking community by the Hudson River
>> Watertrail Association. Learn more about HRWA at www.hrwa.org
>>
>> To unsubscribe or change delivery options:
>> http://www.rockandwater.net/mailman/listinfo/nyckayaker
>>
> **********************************************************************
> The NYCKayaker mailing list is hosted by www.rockandwater.net, and is a public service offered to the kayaking community by the Hudson River Watertrail Association. Learn more about HRWA at www.hrwa.org
> 
> To unsubscribe or change delivery options:
> http://www.rockandwater.net/mailman/listinfo/nyckayaker
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 4
> Date: Mon, 19 May 2008 16:45:32 -0400
> From: Chalu Kim 
> Subject: Re: NYCkayaker Captain and Paddlers Day at Pier 66
> To: Steve McAllister 
> Cc: nyckayaker 
> Message-ID: 
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
> 
> Steve McAllister wrote:
>> Hi Warren
>>> What I took away from this was to realize that the strobe debate is  
>>> not dead.
>>>   
>> 
>> I know what you mean. Even the Coast Guard can't agree.
>> 
>> I for one am not looking for any more reasons to have the Coast Guard 
>> chase me down because somebody on shore thinks I a look like a boat in 
>> distress.
>> Adding a strobe would just increase the calls to the coast guard and 
>> paddlers already have a bad enough reputation as it is.
>> 
>> stevie
>> 
> 
> Expect more bad calls. It is now cool to be a kayaker. There are a lot 
> more recreational boats being sold; shorter boats.
> 
> With NYC going nuts about the water access, we are bound to have close 
> and bad and whatever calls.
> 
> -- 
> 
> Chalu Kim
> 
> eGenius Inc.
> (212) 796-0992 x 101
> chalu at egenius.com
> 
> Practitioners of magical codes and open and compassionate computing.
> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 5
> Date: Mon, 19 May 2008 16:50:34 -0400
> From: "Nancy Brous" 
> Subject: NYCkayaker use of strobes (was captain and paddlers' day)
> To: nyckayaker at rockandwater.net
> Message-ID:
> 	
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
> 
> first off, another thank you to HRPG for a great event that benefits our
> entire community--nice job, folks.
> 
> about the use of strobes--a few of us were talking about this after the
> event:  what do people think of using a different color strobe, preferably
> one not already associated with a particular signal?  seems this would
> address the visibility issue and the desire to not be taken for a rescue
> beacon.  the color, as long as it does not already "mean" something to other
> mariners, would not matter, and would not have to be universal.  the point,
> as lyn says, is simply to be seen.  someone suggested the possibility of a
> red flashing bicycle light, as these are widely available, or perhaps some
> kind of dive light (i think these are available as strobes in a variety of
> colors).
> 
> any thoughts?
> 
> -nb
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 6
> Date: Mon, 19 May 2008 17:11:00 -0400
> From: john mcgarvey 
> Subject: Re: NYCkayaker use of strobes (was captain and paddlers' day)
> To: "Nancy Brous" 
> Cc: nyckayaker at rockandwater.net
> Message-ID: 
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed; delsp=yes
> 
> good points.  perhaps it is also the speed of the flashing.  a strobe  
> is a very fast universal signal, but a waterproof flashing light (as  
> long as it is not red or blue which could be interpreted as police or  
> coast guard) would be quite effective.
> 
> any marine beacon products out there that are suitable for small  
> craft?  something that is not associated with a channel marker of  
> course.
> 
> ~j
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On May 19, 2008, at 4:50 PM, Nancy Brous wrote:
> 
>> first off, another thank you to HRPG for a great event that benefits  
>> our
>> entire community--nice job, folks.
>>
>> about the use of strobes--a few of us were talking about this after  
>> the
>> event:  what do people think of using a different color strobe,  
>> preferably
>> one not already associated with a particular signal?  seems this would
>> address the visibility issue and the desire to not be taken for a  
>> rescue
>> beacon.  the color, as long as it does not already "mean" something  
>> to other
>> mariners, would not matter, and would not have to be universal.  the  
>> point,
>> as lyn says, is simply to be seen.  someone suggested the  
>> possibility of a
>> red flashing bicycle light, as these are widely available, or  
>> perhaps some
>> kind of dive light (i think these are available as strobes in a  
>> variety of
>> colors).
>>
>> any thoughts?
>>
>> -nb
>> **********************************************************************
>> The NYCKayaker mailing list is hosted by www.rockandwater.net, and  
>> is a public service offered to the kayaking community by the Hudson  
>> River Watertrail Association. Learn more about HRWA at www.hrwa.org
>>
>> To unsubscribe or change delivery options:
>> http://www.rockandwater.net/mailman/listinfo/nyckayaker
>>
>>
> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 7
> Date: Mon, 19 May 2008 17:45:35 -0400
> From: "Gordon, Peter" 
> Subject: Re: NYCkayaker Captain and Paddlers Day at Pier 66
> To: "nyckayaker" 
> Message-ID:
> 	
> Content-Type: text/plain;	charset="US-ASCII"
> 
> An alternative if being approached by a motor boat is to wave your
> paddle in the air back and forth to attract their attention.  This might
> actually be a bit more attention than a strobe light.
> 
> Peter Gordon
>  
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nyckayaker-bounces at rockandwater.net
> [mailto:nyckayaker-bounces at rockandwater.net] On Behalf Of Lyn Goldsmith
> Sent: Monday, May 19, 2008 4:02 PM
> To: Steve McAllister
> Cc: nyckayaker
> Subject: Re: NYCkayaker Captain and Paddlers Day at Pier 66
> 
> There are 2 scenarios that using the strobe makes total sense to me.
> 1-Crossing the river and seeing a power boat coming towards you without
> knowing whether they have seen you or not.  This has happened a few
> times
> and it's disconcerting to say the least.
> 
> 2-Ferry terminal at night.
> 
> In fact, I felt a bit like a fool for not having thought of using it
> before
> as I've been in both circumstances many times.
> 
> Until C&P day I considered the strobe as only an emergency device.  Now
> I
> feel like I have another tool in the box.   I guess that I'd rather
> defend
> myself to a Coast Guard officer than risk getting run down.
> 
> 
> Lyn
> 
> On Mon, May 19, 2008 at 3:32 PM, Steve McAllister
> 
> wrote:
> 
>> Hi Warren
>>> What I took away from this was to realize that the strobe debate is
>>> not dead.
>>>
>>
>> I know what you mean. Even the Coast Guard can't agree.
>>
>> I for one am not looking for any more reasons to have the Coast Guard
>> chase me down because somebody on shore thinks I a look like a boat in
>> distress.
>> Adding a strobe would just increase the calls to the coast guard and
>> paddlers already have a bad enough reputation as it is.
>>
>> stevie
>>
>> --
>> Kayaking, as I know it, is a swimming sport, and the kayak a
> prosthesis to
>> make the swimming faster, safer, warmer, and more capable in difficult
>> conditions. Kayaks and paddles enhance our swimming ability in the
> same way
>> that skis enhance our running capability on slopes covered with snow.
> -- Dan
>> Segal
>>
>> **********************************************************************
>> The NYCKayaker mailing list is hosted by www.rockandwater.net, and is
> a
>> public service offered to the kayaking community by the Hudson River
>> Watertrail Association. Learn more about HRWA at www.hrwa.org
>>
>> To unsubscribe or change delivery options:
>> http://www.rockandwater.net/mailman/listinfo/nyckayaker
>>
> **********************************************************************
> The NYCKayaker mailing list is hosted by www.rockandwater.net, and is a
> public service offered to the kayaking community by the Hudson River
> Watertrail Association. Learn more about HRWA at www.hrwa.org
> 
> To unsubscribe or change delivery options:
> http://www.rockandwater.net/mailman/listinfo/nyckayaker
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 8
> Date: Mon, 19 May 2008 17:59:10 -0400
> From: "Lyn Goldsmith" 
> Subject: Re: NYCkayaker Captain and Paddlers Day at Pier 66
> To: "Gordon, Peter" 
> Cc: nyckayaker 
> Message-ID:
> 	
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
> 
> Hi Peter-thanks for weighing in here.
> 
> That's always been my default action, what I was taught.
> 
> The problem (which I never saw as a problem as it was the only known course
> of action until a few days ago) is twofold.  Paddle is black and there is no
> way to be in motion while signaling.
> 
> Having been torn between paddling and waving my paddle a few times I have to
> say I was delighted to have another option.
> 
> Lyn
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On Mon, May 19, 2008 at 5:45 PM, Gordon, Peter <
> pgordon at exchange.tc.columbia.edu> wrote:
> 
>> An alternative if being approached by a motor boat is to wave your
>> paddle in the air back and forth to attract their attention.  This might
>> actually be a bit more attention than a strobe light.
>>
>> Peter Gordon
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nyckayaker-bounces at rockandwater.net
>> [mailto:nyckayaker-bounces at rockandwater.net] On Behalf Of Lyn Goldsmith
>> Sent: Monday, May 19, 2008 4:02 PM
>> To: Steve McAllister
>> Cc: nyckayaker
>> Subject: Re: NYCkayaker Captain and Paddlers Day at Pier 66
>>
>> There are 2 scenarios that using the strobe makes total sense to me.
>> 1-Crossing the river and seeing a power boat coming towards you without
>> knowing whether they have seen you or not.  This has happened a few
>> times
>> and it's disconcerting to say the least.
>>
>> 2-Ferry terminal at night.
>>
>> In fact, I felt a bit like a fool for not having thought of using it
>> before
>> as I've been in both circumstances many times.
>>
>> Until C&P day I considered the strobe as only an emergency device.  Now
>> I
>> feel like I have another tool in the box.   I guess that I'd rather
>> defend
>> myself to a Coast Guard officer than risk getting run down.
>>
>>
>> Lyn
>>
>> On Mon, May 19, 2008 at 3:32 PM, Steve McAllister
>> 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Hi Warren
>>>> What I took away from this was to realize that the strobe debate is
>>>> not dead.
>>>>
>>>
>>> I know what you mean. Even the Coast Guard can't agree.
>>>
>>> I for one am not looking for any more reasons to have the Coast Guard
>>> chase me down because somebody on shore thinks I a look like a boat in
>>> distress.
>>> Adding a strobe would just increase the calls to the coast guard and
>>> paddlers already have a bad enough reputation as it is.
>>>
>>> stevie
>>>
>>> --
>>> Kayaking, as I know it, is a swimming sport, and the kayak a
>> prosthesis to
>>> make the swimming faster, safer, warmer, and more capable in difficult
>>> conditions. Kayaks and paddles enhance our swimming ability in the
>> same way
>>> that skis enhance our running capability on slopes covered with snow.
>> -- Dan
>>> Segal
>>>
>>> **********************************************************************
>>> The NYCKayaker mailing list is hosted by www.rockandwater.net, and is
>> a
>>> public service offered to the kayaking community by the Hudson River
>>> Watertrail Association. Learn more about HRWA at www.hrwa.org
>>>
>>> To unsubscribe or change delivery options:
>>> http://www.rockandwater.net/mailman/listinfo/nyckayaker
>>>
>> **********************************************************************
>> The NYCKayaker mailing list is hosted by www.rockandwater.net, and is a
>> public service offered to the kayaking community by the Hudson River
>> Watertrail Association. Learn more about HRWA at www.hrwa.org
>>
>> To unsubscribe or change delivery options:
>> http://www.rockandwater.net/mailman/listinfo/nyckayaker
>> **********************************************************************
>> The NYCKayaker mailing list is hosted by www.rockandwater.net, and is a
>> public service offered to the kayaking community by the Hudson River
>> Watertrail Association. Learn more about HRWA at www.hrwa.org
>>
>> To unsubscribe or change delivery options:
>> http://www.rockandwater.net/mailman/listinfo/nyckayaker
>>
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NYCKayaker mailing list
> NYCKayaker at rockandwater.net
> http://www.rockandwater.net/mailman/listinfo/nyckayaker
> 
> 
> End of NYCKayaker Digest, Vol 33, Issue 18
> ******************************************